Author Topic: Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge  (Read 59 times)

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Lemuel

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Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge
« on: July 06, 2018, 02:23:46 AM »
Speaker: Beloved/Lemuel
Subject: Information is not Knowledge
Place: Girona, Catalunya, Spain.
Date/Time: 6th July 2018  8:23 Local  07.23 Z

https://app.box.com/s/awg7tmfxtpm87owp4v5fdv302tgazlvc

Clency

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Re: Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2018, 09:05:52 AM »
Transcribed from Lemuel’s audio transmission

Information is not knowledge

Beloved/Lemuel : Our talk this morning is about « Information » and « Knowledge ». Many years ago, way back in January 1960, I was involved in a car accident and after hospital and rehabilitation, I was medically down-graded for one year. I was serving in the army with air-forces at the time and I could not continue parachuting, so they me put on light duties for one year which really consisted in twelve hours a day looking up at the car park or really a military car park.

Anyway, I started to read everything I could find about life in general, looking for answers to why I had to experience that accident and over the next seven years I can say I did read books, I devoured them. I read so many books on different topics – theology, philosophy, psychology – and they were all interesting and I enjoy reading them. I also read some books about the mystics and many others I can’t remember them more now.

The point is I came to realize that the information that I have received over the years from so many books was really just informations, although very interesting and rewarding in the sense it is still just information. Reading about what other people think, what other people beleive or the opinions of other people and I realize that is not knowledge.

Knowledge can only come from experience and this is the difference between existential and experiential. People who just read books and learn all sorts of different things but it never leads to knowledge, because knowledge only comes from experience. You can read a manual how to drive a car or how to play the piano or how to fly a plane or whatever it is and you can become an expert on that book, but it is not knowledge, it is not experience.

You all know this to be true, it is very simple and easy to understand what I am saying. Information does not and cannot and never will lead to knowledge. Knowledge only comes from experience. Elderly people these days, they have to retire at 65 yrs of age or even before then when they lose their jobs, because it is only young people that society thinks that they can offer something to industry or whatever. The middle age people and old people are put on the sidelines, so to speak.

There is a wealth of knowledge and experience in the hands of people, as well you know old people generally are wise people, they have the wisdom of old age full of experience, not just full of reading books and swallowing other people understanding things. No, my friends, if you want to become knowledgeable you have to experience. When you experience you know for yourself it is true and you can hang your hat on it and you can teach it, because you know it is true.

Looking back over the years, reading so many books and they all had value in a sense that they were stepping stones, leading me on to eventually come to the understanding that information is not knowledge, one must experience. In spiritual terms of course it begs the question : how can one experience things of spirit.

All of you here on the forum have been led to the forum whether it is because of you have read the Urantia Book or you hear about the forum, nevertheless you are here presumably to seek your own experience. Those of you on the forum who are guests and who are reading the postings, remember you are reading what other people think, what other people beleive and what other people say they know.

This is not knowledge, this is still information and you need your own experience to become knowledgeable and so if you are familiar with Urantia Book you will read about your Thought Adjuster. This is a Gift of Father of Himself, the True Fragment of God that comes to you in your childhood and resides in your higher mind. This is information that you may accept or deny but you will never know until you experience for yourself that it is true or it is false.

Coming to terms, coming to understand that you do indeed have the Fragment of God,,  called the Thought Adjuster, it needs to be exprienced for you to know one way or the other and this is why it is so necessary for you to practice and enter into stillness, making yourself available to have the experience of your Beloved Thought Adjuster. It takes time and it takes practice and it is an act of faith ; yes it is an act of faith, but it is the only way you will have your own experience and it is the experience that gives you knowledge.

So, dear friends, you may continue to read and investigate what other people think, what other people say, what other people beleive in. That’s fine, there is nothing wrong in that, but remember it is only information. If you want to become knowledgeable and wise then you need your own experience and therefore find your time to experience what you need to experience and this is a tremendous difference between information and knowledge.

Just to repeat, information will never lead to knowledge, only your own personal experience, in whatever field, can bring you knowledge and with the accumulative knowledge of a lifetime not only are you knowledgeable but you will also be wise and it is this knowledge and wisdom that you may be able to pass on to others who are wanting to be as you are, a knowledgeable and wise person based on a lifetime of experience.

Thank you my friends for listening. To-day being Friday, I wish you a wonderful weekend, bye-bye for now. Domtia
Oh, Lord ! I am your servant, I am your liege, it is my will to have your will be done, I am yours for eternity.

newstarsaphire

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Re: Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2018, 11:53:48 AM »
Dear Lemuel,

The Urantia Book most certainly attempts to bring the need and value of 'experience' to our conscious understanding as it refers to and highlights the need for 'experience' repeatedly and just to name a few examples:

- experiential knowledge
- experiential wisdom
- experiential reason
- experiential destiny
- experiential existence
- experiential evolution

I offer a few examples from the Urantia Book:

"(31:3.7) 3. The glorified mortals of the Paradise Corps of Finality are ascendant beings in possession of experiential knowledge of every step of the actuality and philosophy of the fullest possible life of intelligent existence, while during the ages of this ascent from the lowest material worlds to the spiritual heights of Paradise, these surviving creatures have been trained to the limits of their capacity respecting every detail of every divine principle of the just and efficient, as well as merciful and patient, administration of all the universal creation of time and space."

(118:8.6) The slowness of evolution, of human cultural progress, testifies to the effectiveness of that brake—material inertia—which so efficiently operates to retard dangerous velocities of progress. Thus does time itself cushion and distribute the otherwise lethal results of premature escape from the next-encompassing barriers to human action. For when culture advances overfast, when material achievement outruns the evolution of worship-wisdom, then does civilization contain within itself the seeds of retrogression; and unless buttressed by the swift augmentation of experiential wisdom, such human societies will recede from high but premature levels of attainment, and the "dark ages" of the interregnum of wisdom will bear witness to the inexorable restoration of the imbalance between self-liberty and self-control.

(180:5.2) Divine truth is a spirit-discerned and living reality. Truth exists only on high spiritual levels of the realization of divinity and the consciousness of communion with God. You can know the truth, and you can live the truth; you can experience the growth of truth in the soul and enjoy the liberty of its enlightenment in the mind, but you cannot imprison truth in formulas, codes, creeds, or intellectual patterns of human conduct. When you undertake the human formulation of divine truth, it speedily dies. The post-mortem salvage of imprisoned truth, even at best, can eventuate only in the realization of a peculiar form of intellectualized glorified wisdom. Static truth is dead truth, and only dead truth can be held as a theory. Living truth is dynamic and can enjoy only an experiential existence in the human mind.

(112:5.5) And it is this very power of choice, the universe insignia of freewill creaturehood, that constitutes man's greatest opportunity and his supreme cosmic responsibility. Upon the integrity of the human volition depends the eternal destiny of the future finaliter; upon the sincerity of the mortal free will the divine Adjuster depends for eternal personality; upon the faithfulness of mortal choice the Universal Father depends for the realization of a new ascending son; upon the steadfastness and wisdom of decision-actions the Supreme Being depends for the actuality of experiential evolution."

Domtia Lemuel and your Beloved Adjuster for this timely reminder

I picture people standing on the shoreline of a beautiful beach on a hot day watching someone enjoying the refreshing coolness of the water and waves, that refreshes and even strengthens them, beckoning to those on shore to "come on in the water's fine".
« Last Edit: July 06, 2018, 12:00:09 PM by newstarsaphire »
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LarryG

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Re: Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2018, 12:54:42 PM »
Here is an interesting article on the difference between information and knowledge.

Difference Between Knowledge and Information
• Categorized under Language,Words | Difference Between Knowledge and Information
Knowledge vs Information
The human mind’s content is based on the kinds of things that one interacts with on a daily basis. Many a time people perceive things based on either what they have seen, experienced, heard, read, learned or inferred after some experimentation. These perceptions are then categorized in the mind as data, information, knowledge, understanding or wisdom. Unlike wisdom, information and knowledge perceptions are as a result of what the brain has recorded in the past. That said, we need to know how knowledge differs from information (if it does) and if one can exist without the other.
Information refers to data that has been given some meaning by way of relational connection. In computing terms it is data that has been processed. The ‘meaning’ applied to the data may not necessarily be useful. For instance, data stored in a database can be processed by a procedure or a program to give information about something, for example a banking application can determine how a particular account balance increased by returning the record of the credit that occurred to that account using data stored in a database somewhere, so ‘information’ would have been retrieved about that transaction. It is important to know that without information, you will not have knowledge.
So what is knowledge?

Knowledge is the concise and appropriate collection of information in a way that makes it useful. Knowledge refers to a deterministic process where patterns within a given set of information are ascertained. We can also positively say that when a person memorizes some information about something, then they have knowledge about it. That knowledge will have some useful and even applicable use to them but even if that’s the case, that knowledge doesn’t in itself provide for integration such as would infer further knowledge. Take the example of elementary school kids who memorize knowledge of the multiplication table (times table), for instance like the result of 3 times 3 is 9(3*3=9), because they have amassed knowledge of the table. However, the kids will not be able to respond positively when asked the result of 2300*150 as that entry isn’t in the table. It takes true analytical ability and the ability to reduce it to empirical factual knowledge, not just some memorized set of knowledge.
Summary:
 1.  Information is processed data whereas knowledge is information that is modeled to be useful.
 2.  You need information to be able to get knowledge.
 3.  Information deals with the way data is related while knowledge examines patterns within a given set of information.
 4.  To get knowledge you need some cognitive and analytical ability while for information you do not need cognitive ability.

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Clency

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Re: Audio Transmission/ Information is not Knowledge
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2018, 10:03:45 PM »
In short, accumulative informations are useful in the sense that knowledge can be acquired by drawing on the database of informations and that experience comes with practical knowledge. Right ? So, if I go by with this definition, it is not wrong by saying that information, knowledge and experience are intimately linked together and go hand in hand. Domtia
Oh, Lord ! I am your servant, I am your liege, it is my will to have your will be done, I am yours for eternity.